Brilliant Ideas

#16: Brooke Greening on High-Ticket Sales: Mastering Conversations That Convert

• Alyssa Bellisario • Season 1 • Episode 16

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Tired of potential clients disappearing after seemingly positive sales conversations? You're not alone. The sales process for digital products—especially high-ticket coaching programs—often feels like navigating a minefield of objections, hesitation, and the dreaded "ghosting."

Sales expert Brooke Greening joins me to reveal her transformative VCA method (Validate, Clarify, Advance) that turns tense sales conversations into authentic problem-solving discussions. Rather than pushing past objections or manipulating prospects, Brooke shows how validation creates immediate trust: "I don't want you to waste your money either" becomes the bridge that connects you with hesitant prospects.

We uncover why ghosting happens (hint: it's about vague next steps) and how to eliminate it by ensuring two critical questions are answered before ending any sales call. You'll discover why "I'll send you a proposal" without specific follow-up plans practically guarantees prospects will vanish. Instead, Brooke teaches exactly how to create clarity that moves sales forward naturally.

For those struggling with consistent sales, Brooke distinguishes between marketing and sales problems, explaining how to identify if you're attracting qualified leads but failing to convert them. We explore the difference between surface-level objections and the deeper motivational challenges that truly drive purchasing decisions, plus when to consider creating "foot in the door" offers to build trust before selling high-ticket programs.

The episode concludes with Brooke's game-changing "Brilliant Byte"—responding to genuine inquiries within two hours—a simple practice that demonstrates your value for potential clients while giving you a significant advantage over slower competitors. 

Ready to transform your sales conversations? 

Take Brooke's Sales Conversation Assessment through the link in our show notes and start turning objections into opportunities today.

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Brooke:

I would encourage you that when people are reaching out to you not spammy LinkedIn or whatever, but like they've truly said, hey, I want to talk to you that you respond to them within two hours.

Alyssa:

Welcome to Brilliant Ideas, the podcast that takes you behind the scenes of some of the most inspiring digital products created by solopreneurs just like you. I'm your host, alyssa, a digital product strategist who helps subject matter experts grow their business with online courses, memberships, coaching programs and eBooks. If you're a solopreneur with dreams of packaging your expertise into a profitable digital product, then this is the podcast for you. Expect honest conversations of how they started, the obstacles they overcame, lessons learned the hard way and who faced the same fears, doubts and challenges you're experiencing, from unexpected surprises to breakthrough moments and everything in between. Tune in, get inspired and let's spark your next big, brilliant idea.

Alyssa:

Welcome back to another episode of the Brilliant Ideas Podcast. In this episode, brooke Greening is an expert sales coach of building momentum, and today we're exploring the best ways to handle objections, how to tackle the dreaded ghosting problem and uncover her top tips for making more money. If you're in the phase of selling digital products right now, this episode is for you. Welcome to the show, brooke. Thank you for being here. Thank you so much, alyssa. I'm glad to be here. It's great to have you here and to shine a light on sales conversations.

Alyssa:

Now. Some of my listeners are at their point in their business where they've created their digital products and now it's time to sell. But the problem when they get to selling is becoming comfortable with the sales conversations that need to happen. Now the sales conversations that I'm referring to are for businesses who have medium to high ticket coaching programs that they sell and they usually have. They usually require a conversation before the customer commits, and so at some point in their sales cycle they'll come across sales objections from their customers. So my question is how can they handle a sales objection and then turn it into a positive experience for that customer?

Brooke:

A hundred percent. So, in regards because we actually use a sales framework, that we work with our clients in regards to the conversations that they're having, and one piece of that is being able to identify the objections, because one it's really important to be able to identify the objections. I say that because sometimes we think if we have a sales conversation and no objections came up, then that's great and they're like, fantastic, they're going to buy. That's probably not the case. They just didn't feel comfortable to share that objection with you. And then that's usually what happens when people are getting ghosted or they keep trying to go back, and it just goes back and forth and back and forth. So the very first piece in regards to being able to identify the objections is you want to be able to validate. So we have a three-prong method, we call it the VCA method, when it comes to objections. It's validate, clarify and advance. And that first piece is actually validating and that is how you're going to be able to bring value and for your potential customer to trust you, your potential client to trust you, because when people start to share their objections and if we downplay it or if we go around it or if we say, hey, it's really not that big of a night, a big deal. Or we try to like either make them feel bad for having that objection, or we try to like have them visualize how their life would be if their problem was solved, because we're hoping they'll just not remember the objection.

Brooke:

That's happening, none of those work, and that is when the walls are going to go up and that's when they are going to say, okay, no, I don't, I don't want to be able to move forward with you, and that's why we, as business owners and as we're, we have our clients. We don't want to have anything to do with that because we just manipulating is just not the way to go and we don't want to have anything to do with that. It's our company, it's our reputation, all of those things. So the very first piece in handling objection is actually just validating it. That is the very first piece. So if someone says I don't want to waste my money, we validate I don't want you to waste your money either. If someone says I don't really know if I'm going to get the return that I'm looking for, we say the last thing I want is for you to make an investment with me where you don't get the investment that you're looking for. All you have to do is validate.

Alyssa:

I get that. That totally makes sense. I love how you explain that. Now, this whole validating because when I have a sales conversation and you know they might be shy or they don't really want to open up or really ask the questions that they really want to ask, does the validating help to break down those walls and help them feel like, oh, it's okay to really tell them, tell the person that they're you know. If it's if they're selling a coaching program, for example does validation make it easier for them to take down those some of those?

Brooke:

walls A hundred percent. And I would say, as we would start the conversation, because we don't usually hit objections like one minute or two minutes into the sales conversation. We only get to the objections after we've truly understood where their problems are at and if we can be able to help them, that's after that. That's when the objections come into play. And so you're you're working on taking that wall down from the very beginning. When you're setting the expectations for them, you're working on taking that wall down. When you're establishing the rapport, you're taking that wall down. When you start having questions that are intentional and are about their business and what their frustrations are facing, you're beginning to take that wall down.

Brooke:

People's walls go up because they're just anticipating to get pitched. That's all they're like. And what's crazy is they've even set the call, like they've even said okay, I know this is probably going to be uncomfortable, but my pain point is so much bigger that I'm willing to actually talk to somebody, and so they're just bracing themselves for the onslaught to hit. Either we're going to ask maybe one or two questions and then we just launch into our pitch of how great our coaching is, or whatever the case is, and when they realize, as we set that expectation and establishing rapport, this is not going to be a regular sales conversation.

Brooke:

This is truly me trying to understand what are your needs? Can I help you? Great, let's talk about that investment. If I can't, then let me give you other resources. The whole goal of a sales conversation is to help them solve their problem and have it be closer to when they got on the call with me, whether they work with me or not, and that's what I teach my clients and that's when the pressure goes off of them and off of that potential client. Because now we're not into the situation of me trying to convince you to do something you don't want to do, you buying something that you may not need. No, like you have a frustration, you have a problem. Let's figure out what that is and then let's talk about how either I can help you solve it or someone else can.

Alyssa:

Interesting. So then it could be tricky, though, when you're in the sales conversation and now everything seems to go really well, you're handling those objections, you're validating, and then at some point they say, yeah, I love what you're doing, I want to work with you. You send them that coaching contract or that proposal, and then you hear nothing back or the client says well, they're, you know, they're excited to work with me. Like I don't understand why they're not answering my emails or my follow-ups. And then you decide, you think to yourself is it me Like is, am I the problem? And so there's a lot of frustration around that, especially for, you know, for my clients and clients and people who I've talked to. They just feel very confused by this, like they completely ghosted me and like do I? How many times do I fall before I become annoying? And so what advice do you have to handle the ghosting problem that a lot of people face?

Brooke:

yes, I, I have a method to be able to help with the ghosting, but if I can just step back one step, because I think where the ghosting happens is because things were unclear or they were vague. So if we go back to the objections and we say, okay, yes, we're validating, we don't just stop there, because if we just stop it, then they're going to be like fantastic you agree with me off, we go instead of we validate and then we clarify specifically where that objection is coming from. We are trying to figure out what's motivating them, what's driving them from being able to make that decision. So then we're going to start asking questions in regards to what concerns or questions do you have before we move forward, so we can start to figure out where that is. Then we're clarifying, because we're clarifying not to convince them to buy from us, but we're clarifying to truly figure out. Are they confused about the price? Are they confused about how this is going to help them? Are they confused about what that next step is? And then, after we clarify, then that's when we would advance and say, okay, are we moving forward with what we originally talked about? Are we moving forward with something that's a little bit even higher because we're realizing you need more support? Or have we decided that we actually missed it and this would be a better option and it's more of a downsell? Or have we just decided this is not a good fit and let me give you other resources to be able to help you as you go on your way?

Brooke:

After that, then we would go into explaining next steps, and that's why things get vague and that's why people get ghosted, because they literally just say, hey, let me send you a proposal or let me send you a contract, and then I'm going to call you in a week and see if you have any questions, and that is not actually a good process. That's very vague because we need to know two things, and this is what's going to help you in regards to if you don't want to get ghosted. One, your potential client needs to know exactly what they need to do next to move forward with you. Date and time, that's what they need to know. And then, two, you need to know are they going to do it? If so, when? And if not, why? If we do not have those two questions answered, we will not be able to move forward and then the ghosting will happen, because we're going to call them and we're going to say, hey, did you get my contract? Wanted to see if you have any questions. Miracle of all miracles, they actually answer the phone and they're just going to say, yes, I got it, no questions. Well, now what? Now we're stuck. Oh, that makes sense. That's why you want to say, ok, we need to have these two questions answered.

Brooke:

So in any sales call that anyone's ever having, the goal is not did I win, did we sell it? Like, did it end? Did they give me the check? That's not usually the goal, especially when you're talking about these higher ticket items and they need they're gonna have to sign contracts, they're gonna have to make decisions. The next step is just making sure. Do they know what they need to do next?

Brooke:

Clearly, so if I say I'm gonna send the contract, say, hey, I'm happy to, I'm gonna send you this contract, you're gonna be able to review it. And then when do you think you're gonna be able to sign it? Like, if we're talking about a contract, if we're talking about proposal, that's a little bit different and that's when I would say something along the line of I'm happy to send you a proposal, but the next step would actually be for us to set up a time right now of when we're going to review that proposal in person, and then we can go from there. So now we're not dealing with ghosting and we actually know are they going to do it or are they not going to. But if we just leave it vague, that's why it's ghosting. That's literally what's happening most of the time, cause people aren't trying to be nasty or whatever the case is. They're just like there's really nothing for us to talk about. I don't really know what we're doing. So that's why you want to be so clear with what to do next.

Alyssa:

Oh, I love that. And I think I've made that mistake, like early on in my business, like very like a, you know, I'm thinking like maybe 2020, 2021, where, you know, I was still new to the business and so I left things kind of open-ended and experienced ghosting myself in it. I was like what is going on here? And I just and you know, as you get better at it, you know, and you're sending out contracts or proposals or things like that, you do end up learning that you need to be very clear on the sales call or having a sales conversation about, okay, next steps, I'm going to send it by tonight and then when did you want to start the project?

Alyssa:

So I start asking questions, things like you know, like what is your timeline for starting the project? When are you available? Let's book your strategy call right now, and then they'll be like oh, okay, yeah, this is the time that I'm available. So it feels like you know, at some point, maybe they're at some time later, maybe their finances don't work out in the end and somehow it doesn't work out but to at least try to, you know, be proactive and like set those timelines in advance so that you're not feeling like, oh crap, I didn't do this, and like, what is the next step? And by the time you email them the contract or the proposal and they get back to you, then you have to ask them well, when are you available? And it's just this back and forth BS. Yes.

Alyssa:

Like, let's just avoid all of that. Yeah, just completely, and so I mean I've had to learn that over time in business, but you have really you know it's good for almost, because it feels like you know you're like they said, yes, everything was good, and then you didn't hear from them, and so you can cut through all of that by just using your method.

Brooke:

Yeah Well, you absolutely can. And then the other pieces, like from the beginning, if I can encourage because sometimes people get ghosted from the front end, not so much the backend, but if you are actually intentional and so say, a lead reaches out to you, if you're responding quickly within like two hours, and if you're actually making that, if they've scheduled an appointment with you, you have automations going out saying, hey, we've got it, we're excited to talk to you. That's really important. But even if you take that very next step and give them a call and say I'm so excited that you've been able to set up a time and talk to them for just a few minutes, that makes it a lot less likely that they're going to ghost you because they've already started to build that relationship with you. So you can help from getting ghosted from the front end and on the back end as well.

Brooke:

And if I can just encourage, I know a lot of times probably for your listeners they don't want to be pushy, they don't want to come across as salesy, because that's not who they are.

Brooke:

They are coaching, they are helping, they are giving direction. But I just want to encourage you. You are the leader and so you have to lead the sales call, just like you would lead your coaching, and they are looking to you to help them and to guide them. And if we do not give them clear steps, we are not actually setting that best foot forward. And the onboarding starts way before we actually sign the contract. We're starting from the first sales conversation because they're going to be working with you and so they are beginning to know who you are, what your reputation is, how you just handle different things, and so by you being direct and helping them to know these are the next steps. You're not being pushy at all, you're just showing them. I am here to guide you and to coach you, and that is what I'm going to do from the very beginning of our interaction together.

Alyssa:

I think people forget that. Yeah, I love what you said about onboarding starts from the first conversation, instead of them from the first when they sign the contract and then you go. So that makes it interesting because now you know if my listener, if their coach, their digital product creator, let's say, for example, they've handled their sales objections, they're handling the dreaded ghosting problems that's all like resolved, and then, at the end of the day, sales are what matters. And so if they're not seeing sales every day, what would be the first move that you'd recommend to start they make, to start seeing money coming in?

Brooke:

Yeah, so I think it's really important to understand the difference between marketing and sales, because a lot of times people think that they're doing the exact same thing and they're not. So if you are getting good leads that are saying like, yes, I want what you have to offer and I can afford it, that's a great lead, so your marketing is working well. But if you are having to have a lot of those in order to close one sale, that's when the sales are coming in. That's when we're going to say let's take a look at what's going on in your sales conversation, because maybe you felt like it was a great conversation, maybe you were able to overcome the objections, but maybe we missed the actual problem that they had. Because if we just hit the first level of that surface level of their problem, we're never going to actually end up making the sale, because that's the first problem is never usually the one that actually moves people forward. There are those internal struggles, those are their philosophical struggles that are going on. That's what motivates them and drives them to make a decision. So that's your first piece, like looking at your sales conversation and being like what did I miss? Because if I truly hit the problem that they had and we were able to overcome the objections, we should be able to move forward.

Brooke:

But then the other piece is is it clear to you? Because if you're having a sales conversation and what you offer or what you do or the product or the package or whatever you want to call it, is like feeling like you have to reinvent the wheel over and over again every sales conversation you have, then I would say that's where it's happening, because then if it's not clear to you and you have to reinvent everything every single time, then they're confused and they're not wanting to move forward. I would highly encourage business owners, especially B2B. We're very gracious and cordial, so we're just not going to tell you no, we're not going to say I really don't think you're going to be able to solve my problem. If it's a nice conversation, they'll probably just be like that's really interesting or that sounds great. How about you send me a proposal and I'll call you if I have questions? That is not actually what is happening in sales.

Brooke:

The other piece I would say is if you have like a big high ticket item which is amazing, is there anything that you could create that could like we call your foot in the door offer, because a lot of times people are not going to go from zero to thousands in one conversation. So then you need to look at well, how intentional is my follow-up? What am I doing to be able to continue to keep moving things forward? And then also, if you're like, but, brooke, I gotta make sales this month, then I would encourage do we have anything like an in-the-door offer? So like, yes, you have your big coaching program. That's amazing. Is there something where they could not pay as much to be able to learn who you are? Gain benefits where it's not killing you in regards to what you're offering them, so that then we can do that? So that's when we're talking like our product ladder. Okay, what are the steps to be able to get to over here?

Alyssa:

Absolutely. I love that approach. It's really helpful to look at your sales conversation first and then see where you can improve on that and then start building that product ladder. That is, yeah, I agree with that, especially if it's very high ticket. It's very, very difficult. You might want to have like that low to medium ticket and then start to upgrade them further because they need more support and more one-to-one intimate support. So that's where, like, the high ticket kind of comes from. Now, just curious though do you have, do you follow a script when you do these sales conversations?

Brooke:

I do not follow a script. No, because, um, it's not fun when they don't follow along and they say the wrong line. Then I'm like, whoa, what am I doing? But I do create, I did create a service framework, so it's an acronym of service, and so it's set expectations, establish rapport, recognize the problem, verbalize the value, identify objections, create urgency and explain next steps. That is what I coach my clients through, so that there are guardrails of how they're able to have the conversation. If you don't have any type of guardrail, that's hard.

Brooke:

Now I say that, but people do reach out to me and say, brooke, can you please write a script for us? Because they just don't really have any idea what to say at that point. And so I'm happy to give that as a starting point. But the goal is to be able for it to be authentic and to be in your voice, and so that's why the service framework comes into play. Do I write scripts for companies? Yes, cause sometimes they're just like, uh, we can't have you train them about the service framework, like we're not ready to do that yet. Can you please write us a script? So, sure, I'm happy to do that, but it is truly the framework that helps.

Alyssa:

You know, what's really funny is that you know I love scripts, but what I find most difficult about following scripts is that you always go off trail anyways. So, like I think it's helpful to have an outline of things that you want to touch upon. Like I write like an agenda of things I want to make sure I hit in my sales conversations, but I can't do a script because I'll never stick to it, like I've tried. I, you know, for it's funny because I'm not like type A or anything. I'm not a type A person. But, um, I feel like I can't.

Alyssa:

I need to have some kind of detailed outline before I even jump on that, just so I feel confident that I know what I'm talking about and the things that I want to talk about with that person, and it also just makes sure that I don't forget anything either. So I mean, I do agree with, like I think, an outline, just a few points of things that I want to, you know, want to talk about but then not to be. But I am not, for like I'm not down with a word for word script, I don't know. I mean, maybe if you're in a phone, like in a call center, maybe that makes sense, but when you're having a sales conversation it has to feel natural. Yeah, and it doesn't feel natural when you're like cause, then it's not going to, it's not, it never lines up.

Brooke:

No, no, no, and I would. I agree a hundred percent. So we call that like our pre-call plan. So we put the service framework together and then they start filling out the pieces, like, okay, this is what I can, this is what I should talk about when setting the expectation. This is the homework that I've done to be able to establish rapport. These are the types of questions I want to ask when I'm recognizing the problem, so that they're doing that beforehand, so that they have those guardrails when they're walking in, and that's like that's important, because you can't wing it. Like these are very important conversations. They're high ticket items.

Brooke:

People are going to tell they can tell right away if you're winging it or if you're going off of a script. And again, they're trusting you to guide them and to coach them, like that's, that's what they're looking for you to do. And so the scripts are not going to be helpful in that. They are helpful in the very first stage when you're trying to figure out okay, how do I actually say that? Cause what happens a lot in my coaching is I'll say something and then they're like wait, can you say that again? And I'm like well, this is why we record it, cause.

Brooke:

I don't know if I can just repeat it verbatim back to you, but in the beginning people need things to be able to say, like to transition from one step to the other. So you could have a sentence or two in regards to this is how I set the expectation. That's a great thing to know how to do, but it's not a script of like well then, if they say this, then I'm going to say this and then dah, dah, dah, dah, cause it. It never goes that way and people can read through it and they're like well, wait a minute, I don't, I don't want to do that, I agree.

Alyssa:

I know it's it, yeah, no, it's great. It's right that learn how to have a conversation with someone and answer things on the spot, and it's a good challenge and it gets you out of your comfort zone as well. So now it's time for our next segment, which is called the Brilliant Bite of the Week, and I really love this one, because this is the part of the show where you're going to share a one quick, high impact tip that my listeners can put into practice right away. So what do you got for them?

Brooke:

All right. Well then I will say, because we've already kind of worked through the service framework, I would encourage you that when people are reaching out to you, not spammy LinkedIn or whatever, but like they've truly said, hey, I want to talk to you, that you respond to them within two hours, that you make it a goal to say I am going to reach out to them in that two hour timeframe and I'm going to talk to them, or I'm going to email them so that they can, you can start to move that process forward, because the longer we wait in regards to responding to those who are reaching out to us, the harder it is. So if you just look at it and you're like, but I got to them like two days later, well, who in the world knows what happens in two days? I'm a mom, I've got little kids Like the whole world could blow up in two days, and so you don't want to do that and you've just given your competitor a huge advantage at that point if you've not done that.

Brooke:

So you want to show them hey, I value you, I want to be able to talk to you. You don't have to go into a full-blown conversation, but you are reaching out to them to be able to establish that next step. Because if you've done that and now you have a call set up and ready to go and you've had this great service framework and you've worked through a lot of things and then their competitor reaches out to them two days later, you've given them a very steep hill to climb to be able to reach where you're already at.

Brooke:

So, just you want to be able to do that.

Alyssa:

No, that's a really great tip, that's amazing. And so you have a really great resource called the Sales Conversation Assessment and this is going to benefit all of my listeners and I'm so excited for you to share a little bit more about what that is and yeah, just describing, like you know who it's for and how can they book.

Brooke:

Yeah, absolutely so.

Brooke:

The sales conversation assessment is for anyone who's having to have these high ticket sales conversations and what is helpful is who's having to have these high ticket sales conversations and what is helpful is it's going to give you a perspective of where you're at.

Brooke:

It gives you that self-reflection. So, as I talked about, our service framework is setting the expectations, establishing the rapport, recognizing the problems of your clients, verbalizing the value of what you do in connection to that, identifying the objections, creating urgency and explaining next steps. So it is a 24 question assessment, takes about three to five minutes and it goes through each part of that framework so that you can see, okay, how am I doing in setting the expectations, how am I doing in establishing rapport. You can take it, it'll give you a score and then it'll send you a report, a more detailed report, for you. After you do that, if you're like, okay, now I kind of know what I could be able to do. To work on that, I have my sales accelerator lab and that's a four-week program and that's where you can join me and I walk you through the service framework. We talk about your product ladder and all the things you can be able to do and it's just four weeks. It helps you to get things moving so that you can continue to make more sales.

Alyssa:

Amazing. That's great, and so I will put that link that links in the show notes of this episode. So I just want to thank you, brooke, for coming on to the show today and sharing all of your wisdom and all of your great advice. I wrote so many notes down, so many notes. Right now I had to go through that and like digest and categorize because I got so much information. So that is great. So thanks so much, brooke, I really appreciate it.

Brooke:

Oh, thank you so much. It was so great to be with you today.

Alyssa:

I know, and yeah so I'm just excited for this, even for me, the sales conversation assessment, you know, because you can always improve, right Like there's always little gaps and things that I think can always be changed, modified, and so that's really where I think that the sales conversation assessment would be so good for my listeners, so make sure to check out that link and for everyone else, if you're listening right now. Thanks, so good for my listeners, so make sure to check out that link and for everyone else, if you're listening right now. Thanks so much for hanging out with us today and I will see you next time on another brilliant idea. Thanks for tuning into this episode of Brilliant Ideas. If you love the show, be sure to leave a review and follow me on Instagram for even more insider tips and inspiration. Ready to bring your next big, brilliant idea to life? Visit AlyssaVelsercom for resources, guidance and everything you need to start creating something amazing.